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Guest konjkav

why?

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Guest maheshabe14

ohhhhh chashhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm hamoontry ke shoma be harfhaye ma khoob goosh mikoni azizam ;)

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Guest BehnoushY

One Q: Having known/heard what you've said so far, che dardi az ma dava mikone?! :huh:

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Im not saying the quran was literally written on paper. I ment skin which was used as paper at that time.

 

Ill drop the subject about barnaba and bibles and things like that because I believe in Jesus fully and I also believe that hes coming back. But I dont believe he went on the cross to die for all humanity's sins.

 

I dont really want to get into this discussion but, let me just ask you what I ask a christion person who came to my door, Isnt God the most forgiving of all? In Islam if we dont believe that God will forgive us its the BIGGEST SIN yes BIGGEST!!!! Now of course God forgives, and if jesus is God or son of God (depending on which type of christian you are) why would he have to kill himself, then resurect himself again just for christians sins, should people just believe in him and want him to forgive them?

 

Im sure you know what us muslims believe happened with jesus but incase you dont, we believe and it says in the quran that he was lifted up and judus who betrayed him was made to look like him. Of course christion historians say that Judus either commited suicide later or just disappeared( at least for the most part). Im not saying anything to doubt Prophet Jesus or Hazrat Maryam which I strongly believe in both and Love both of them. Im saying there was no need for jesus to go on the cross. If God wanted to send everyone to heaven he could he wouldnt have to kill himself or his son or however you look at it. And people have to have some responsibility.

 

I remember one time a preacher in college saying outside, there is sin for us we cant just drink, eat pork , have premarital Sex, we have responsibilites. We wont all go to heaven. And then I remember someone shouting I can do whatever I want Because jesus died for me so that I can go to heaven and all my sins being forgiven.

 

Only if it was that simple. Every action has a reaction everything has an effect on you, your spirit. Your spirit is like a CD it records everything. The normal eye cant tell, but when you put it in a cd player(next life) the true form of the CD shows and plays like a movie.

 

In Islam we hear a lot about if you do this youll be blind in the next world if you do that youll have great vision. Which we cant understand,but the closest thing to us understanding is probably, a child in her mother woom, Imagine we can talk to that child and he understands a to a certain extend. We tell that child dont play with your eyes, youll be blind in the next world, he wont understand he doesnt need his eyes then, but they exist and they are there for a reason. Of course our world is much more complex and when we die its not as simple as that example but something close. Everything we do has an effect on our spirit which is like a CD it wont show in this life but in the next it will play, now a good thing will have a good effect and a bad thing a bad.

 

I dont want to go too deep into it which might get confusing and I dont have the knowledge to go in deeper really. I didnt just write that for you konjkav maybe some of the other muslim people could use that example and might like it. The connection of the different worlds.

 

Sorry for the long posts. And konjkav we are all friends here and I know its hard to have a good discussion over the forum but its nice always to have a discussion in a good manner and I think we havent gone too far off track. I hope anything I might have said did not upset you and I hope that with your answers I get some clarity on the bliefs of christians.

 

Thanks

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Konjkav About Imam Khomeini I dont care what anyone thinks about his political views but everyone accepts him as a knowledgable person. But if you dont accept him for books on this type of things I can name anyone you want european scientist? arab whatever nation you want has come to this conclusion that quran was one of a kind.

 

And also you say the quran doesnt make scientific sense which is funny cause most people NON muslim that look at it are amazed at what it has said. And its funny Famouse European Scientist mathmatician and philospepher say the Quran is perfect from all those aspect yet you think its not.

 

Once there was a man who went to Imam jafaar Sadegh I think it was not 100% sure if it was the 6th Imam but anyways. In Islam we believe after we die and the world dies, on the day of judgement we are all resurrected.

 

Once a man asked Imam jafaar, When I die, how can I become alive again when I deteriate and turn into grass and a cow eats me and a human eats him and the cycle goes on forever so we all become a part of each other. For me to be alive someone else would be missing a part of his body.

 

Imam Jafaar said inside of each of us is a very small thing smaller than a bean, which holds all our information. Which god can grow and can rebuild us exactly the way we were. (DNA)

 

There is soo much science in Quran and the prophets words and the Imams. Just look at all the things Imam Ali had said and done. Just look at the way we eat. You know its recomemndod to eat with your hands. Of course clean hands. Now we find out that your finger tips get more nutriants from teh food and its very healthy to eat with your hands.

 

Is it not true now that doctors and scientist now say Fasting EXACTLY for 30 days is the best way of fasting. Is it not makrooh (bad) to blow on hot food, and now we know that when you blwo on your food the chemical in your mouth changes the properties of the food and it can be harmful for you.

 

There is a Hadith thats very famous Im sure youve heard it its about back biting. (qheybat) It says if you do gheybat or back bite, its like eating the flesh off of your dead brothers back. Now we know when you backbite or do gheybat a acid is spread out in your body which is also the same acid which is on a dead body's back, which of course is harmful for you.

 

If I sit here I can go all day with these types of Facts and they are written in any book you want to believe sony shia non muslim non god believer any case you want. Of course I dont claim I know anything but there is so much in Islam a drop of it I have tried to learn.

 

Please if you want to say something give fact, so I can understand. If you look at Islam combined with the other religion its the way of life. Now I dont want to convince you to become muslim, just dont hate muslims beliefs, you can hate politics you can hate Imam khomeini you can hate all that I dont care but dont Insult the word of god or the prophet. Just the day he was born all those miricles, the way he lived, what happened in his life, the way Imam ali was born the things they did.

 

As a christian you have to believe jesus is coming back, jews believe someone is coming too, and Musllims too quincidince? I think not maybe just maybe we all are waiting for the same people to come???

 

From moses time there was Hazrat Khezr which is still alive, if you guys dont know about him I can brief a little info on him, but hes the person Prophet moses went to to get His lessons, which he couldnt handle. Then Jesus from the Christians and Imam Zaman from the muslims.

 

Now I think maybe just maybe all these religions are right and all these people who have been giving the same divine message are gonna come together, of course for them to come it can only happen in 2 cases.

 

1. which everyone knows is the world is soo bad that Imam Zaman and the people that come with him are needed.

 

2. which not too many people know is that the World becomes so good that they deserve them and are ready for what they have to offer.

 

I know thats 2 Long Posts in a row sorry guys, but I think its worth reading them both, you might find it intresting.

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Guest KOnjkav

you have touched my favorite subject " Hadis"

check out my next post, it is going to be fun, " dont know if itw ill be fun for u though" ;)

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Guest Konjkav

Before getting to the Hadis and bringign some verses and stuff , let me just clear up soemthing, which i can see u dont have clear understanig of those people who came to your door, ( which u said they are christians) .......yes God is forgiving, that is right and i have seen that in Bible saying many times, BUT there is another aspect of nature of God, which is called Holy and Righteous , which most of the time is beeing ignored by musilm frirends....... Dude If God forgives human sin just like that this is against HIs nature, there is a consequence and punishment for sin, if He just forgives sin than his is not righteous........ this is simple.....

that is why that christians belive in sacrifice on the cross as the punishment of the sins,,,,,,,Islam is not built upon any type of redeption, look at the jews read the torah,,,,,,,,what do u think ther beliefe system is buit upon? do u know that? have u ever asked urself why jews are sacrificeng all these lambs and cows in the temple? have u ever asked urself why moses got this laws from God ( which all were symbole of a real thing to come) why do u think God asked Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac? that was the symbole of the real thing to come, and Abram took Isaac upon the same hill where jesus was sacrificed later.... (Genesis22) yes my freind Jews beliefe system is built upon the same truth that God Himslef will provide a sacrifice for human and we see sacrifice is prepared in new testament , as God had promissed in jews book (Isaiah 53) over 300 predictions which i like to call it prohecies mad in Jews book about the savior of the world and the lamb of God who is going to be sacrificed for the world , has come to true in New testament in Bible .......there is a beatiful harmony from the the Old Testament to New testament......preparing the world for the sacrifice.....................and in Isam there is this big hollow.............

 

 

u say every one is waiting for someone to come.......True........Jews are waiting for Christ to come to save the world....( which i think u know that)

and in christianit jesus is the same Christ promised to the jews.........

 

Once again.......dont believe what people say. do ur own research.....it is not such a think Christians can do anything they want cause jesus has died for their sins.......IF U read the Bible , jeus says many will call me Lord Lord but wont enter the kingdom of God, there are few who will be saved, so there is Gods parts and there is Christians part that should be done, God had delivered His promis and now Christians have to take care of their part

 

there is another thing wich bothers me alot in Islam is the way the heaven is pictured in Koran, it is everything but an spiritual realm, u will see women who are vorgin for ever and have nice boobs ( Donr get offended this is in Koran , u can read) and there is wine, and " there is 13 years old boys" can u belive this? sounds like sodoma and Gomorah (not sure about spelling) all i can see in this heaven of Koran , is imagniation of someone who has sexual thirst and loves to drink.....and omg......................and when u look at the Torah and Bible , heaven is a spritual realm where there is no body made by felsh ( there is no blindness and any illness lol) and it is all spiritual relationship with God

 

looks like this is a long one,,,,,, i will answer the second post later, time to sleep in Tehran now :D

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Guest maheshabe14

"u will see women who are vorgin for ever and have nice boobs ( Donr get offended this is in Koran , u can read) and there is wine, and " there is 13 years old boys" can u belive this? sounds like sodoma and Gomorah (not sure about spelling) all i can see in this heaven of Koran , is imagniation of someone who has sexual thirst and loves to drink.....and omg......................and when u look at the Torah and Bible , heaven is a spritual realm where there is no body made by felsh ( there is no blindness and any illness lol) and it is all spiritual relationship with God"

 

 

 

ohhh comeon konkav joon..isnt that every man's fantasy??if God told you that if your good u will be alone underneath a tree with ugly women walking around..would u still be a good person??????????? :huh: :unsure:

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Ok im just not gonna go back into this cause everything I say you take th wrong way see it your way and turn it around.

 

All im gonna say is first of all in the Quran it doesnt say woman with big boobs and stuff it says hura'een, which are very buetiful woman. You have to remember everything has 7 folds and for the people back then to understand how great heaven is they compared it to huge farms, woman, drinks things of that sort which seem great in this life. Now I dont wanna go deep into the quran and 7 layers of meaning and things like that.

 

Im gonna end this topic as hard as it is for me to do. All im gonna say Is i believe in all the prophets. I believe that what we do, well affect us and we will create our own heaven and hell.

 

One part about your post though:

 

Dude If God forgives human sin just like that this is against HIs nature, there is a consequence and punishment for sin, if He just forgives sin than his is not righteous........ this is simple.....

that is why that christians belive in sacrifice on the cross as the punishment of the sins

 

So your telling me a Human that can forgive you is greater than God? So God wont forgive? Its like saying a father wont forgive his son. Didnt Jesus ask God to forgive the people who put him on the cross?? Didnt Jesus himself forgive them for their Ignorace? IF your telling me no matter what we do were going to heaven than the world would be great everyone would be happy. I am gonna end on that note and not get on that subject again.

 

But if anyone has a Question that they are not sure about, or want to have a discussion in relation to something related to Islam Im down, I dont have all the answers and have many questions but I have access to books, and I enjoy talks like this.

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hey Sam joon!

 

May I ask what objective(s) you were trying to achieve by posting this "very" graphic link in this particular threat, considering all the sensitivity that surrounds this issue?

Of course you are entitled to exercise your “democratic” rights and post as you wish, but I’d like to know what possessed a nice guy such as yourself to present such a biased link in this particular threat? May be u were too busy to open up a new one? ;)

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shazdeh_khanom joon,

 

I think the post location is some how relevant with all the talks about Islam and religion, maybe I could have opened a new thread. Anyways if the images offend anyone please accept my apologies.

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Yes they really have to do with Islam, if that has to do with Islam, whats going on in Iraq and Afghanestan has to do with christianity, and whats going on in palestine has to do with Jewdisim.

 

This is about religion not politics.

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Guest Konjkav

I was so moved by seeing this pics and clips, this is the reason that i am tying to say m hey pepple, this is what Islam teaches, this is what Mohammad commanded and this is not even 100 percent executed, if it was the wolrd would be hell.

 

kHodavandi ke por az mohabat va eshgh ast, aya be peirovanash migooyad ke mardom ra che bigonah va gonah kar bekoshid va be intor vahshatnak va vahshi be ghatl beresanieed? ya in mardomkhial mikonand ke khodavand ra peyrovi mikonand.,,?

 

i couldnt see all the website, cause i was about to cry ...... how low someone could be to do these things, this is not politic, again Koran teaches things and not mentioning that Isam and poletics cant be sparated, anyways...... this is my prayer that people could live a free life and have their own beliefe and not get killed for what they belive.......this is just terrible ,How low and voilent can someone be to teach and do these things to people who have been created in God's image.

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Guest maheshabe14

"this is my prayer that people could live a free life and have their own beliefe and not get killed for what they belive"..

 

konjkav joon..as ive said many times before u should start from urself and then have these hopes for the future..when u cannot respect other people's beliefs how can you expect others to be the way you want??

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Guest Guest

We must be like the christians, rape little kids, bomb innocent people rape their wives. Look at Iraq and Afghanestan and look at abu gharib prison look at guantanimo bay?? What the hell you talking about konjkav? If those pictures represent Islam then the things that america does represents christianity.

 

Konjkav your in such a bad mindset of proving Islam wrong.

 

Answer one question for me honestly, what is the point? what is the point of you talking bad about it? If you wanna bring people to Christianity you suppose to be smooth work your way in arent you? Arent you suppose to respect people?

 

Maybe I miss understood jesus though.

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Guest Konjkav

u know what , u'd better read my thread one more time , from bigining to the end, u sound like u have no clue what i am talking about.....as i said i was talking about the BOOKS not regimes. all i mention waas the teachings of Islam from ther Koran, want to talk nasty back it up by versus from Bible, Torah and whatever .......

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Guest maheshabe14
:lol: or u can just read one of mr.kojkav's threads..because it's all the same from beginning to the end! :p :lol:

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Guest maheshabe14
u know what , u'd better read my thread one more time , from bigining to the end, u sound like u have no clue what i am talking about.....as i said i was talking about the BOOKS not regimes. all i mention waas the teachings of Islam from ther Koran, want to talk nasty back it up by versus from Bible, Torah and whatever .......

konjkav joon..so far all youve done was bashed islam..may i ask what ur belief is and why you have so much hatred towards islam?? i really cant believe that in the year 2004 someone can be so disrespecting and ignorant of respecting other people's religions..!!

 

 

if zoroastrians left the dead bodies outside to be pecked up by birds..does that make them violent human beings and will u start bashing them aswell??

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Guest Konjkav

U still ask me why i hate Islam?

sounds u havent read my threads neither :D

 

leaving dead bodies,,,,,,,,,, that is much better than killing "livving humans" people who still breath and theu stone, behaed torture and,,,,,,them

 

see the difference

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Guest maheshabe14
U still ask me why i hate Islam?

sounds u havent read my threads neither :D

 

leaving dead bodies,,,,,,,,,, that is much better than killing "livving humans" people who still breath and theu stone, behaed torture and,,,,,,them

 

see the difference

no konjkav joon..ive read ur threads..u say u dont hate islam..but you do..u seem like your lost..i hope u can stop contradicting what u say....

 

 

violence is violence..and many people behead others..such as in mexico..teh protestants against teh catholics and so on....you cannot say that Christianity is violent..you cannot say Zoroastrianism is violent..and u cannot say anay other religion or peopel of taht faith are violent..please get thet through ur head hon

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From some comments above, I noticed that the acts in IRAQ war to Christianity. Please don’t confuse the two. The acts in Iraq are time of war and the acts are NOT IN THE NAME OF CHRISTIANITY, whether the war is just or not that’s a separate issue. The link shows daily just for people IN THE NAME OF ISLAM. So before hurry up to write your comments, just take a look at the pictures and the story they tell. The events have happened, and you can not justify them by pointing to other inhumane events by anyone else.

 

I am not trying to change anyone’s religion; you have the right to think/believe what you want. But one has to sometimes take an objective look around and make a choice accordingly. Extremism in any form is bad, whether it’s about a religion or lack of it.

 

We sometimes are so comfortable with what/where we are that we forget to question things that are uncomfortable.

 

Look at following link it brings some good points, I am not saying that its all true but no one can surely say it’s all lies either. So in point we need to be open-minded even more that we currently are, because what if it was 100% true? Where do you go if it was? Well be happy with life if you found out at old age and you didn’t do your due diligence in proofing your believes.

 

http://www.kavehroom.com/Ali.htm

 

In fact read all the articles on http://www.kavehroom.com

 

-Sam

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Guest Konjkav

I said i dont hate muslims but i hate islam and i have myown reasons

killing any human being is condamned either in US, Iran, mexico, Irland whenever and it is most terrible when it is done by following of a religious book like Islam, this what contridicts itslef not me,. Islam talks about God and yet teaches kil people who are made in imageof God, this is called contrdict, violnce,hatered and all nasty things u may thing of,,,,

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