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Guest konjkav

Why Allah "supposedly the creator of heaven and earth" appears of someone in charge of mohammads sexual life? " ahzab 50

why is it that in islam says " dar din ejbari nist" then whoevr turns back from Isalm should be killed?

if this is so, so free will would have no meaning. and hell and judgment day wouldnt be nessasary cause we punish people here on earth.

if Koran is the book from heaven why is it that you see many contridictions and mistakes"even historical " and it all talks about killing and hatered.

if it cares about women why is it that in nesa soreh it all talks about that how stupid and unworth women are?

 

 

 

i am just conused ..............

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Just say that you want everyone to convert to christianity bro!!!!

just admit it! ;)

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My friend, I have to agree with Keano here!

You deliberately put down a finger on Islam’s features and tenets!

The truth is, except for the parts exclusive to each messenger, all Abrahamian religions are similar and the ”Books” too full of inner contradictions and questionable accounts!!

Although all claim to be originals, they’ve been revised throughout history by dependent and independent characters!

This critique applies to all of them!

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Guest Guest_Kimo

well, i dont agree about quran being changed

 

because the Holy Qur'an has reached us throw through the process of Tawatur which is(historical continuity and perpetuation achieved through transfer from generation-to-generation)

 

that means that so many people in every generation conveyed it to the next and so on that there can be no doubt about its authenticity. It was not transmitted by a few persons in one generation to a few persons in the next. It was handed over by the entire generation to the next generation.

 

if the Quran was edited in a period time then there will be more than one different copy ..but there are millions of holy Quran books and all of them are the same in every part in the world and in every house

 

konjkav

 

Why Allah "supposedly the creator of heaven and earth" appears of someone in charge of mohammads sexual life? " ahzab 50

can you paraphraise this line a little bit ?

 

if Koran is the book from heaven why is it that you see many contridictions and mistakes"even historical " and it all talks about killing and hatered

What are these mistakes ? can you mention some of them... and i 'll try my best to answer ;)

 

if it cares about women why is it that in nesa soreh it all talks about that how stupid and unworth women are?

which parts you mean ? islam eally cares about woman ... can you specify the parts that you wana ask about ?

 

If you're trying to find the right path i suggest you to do your own research about religion ;)

 

My regards

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well, i dont agree about quran being changed

 

because the Holy Qur'an has reached us throw through the process of Tawatur which is(historical continuity and perpetuation achieved through transfer from generation-to-generation)

 

that means that so many people in every generation conveyed it to the next and so on that there can be no doubt about its authenticity. It was not transmitted by a few persons in one generation to a few persons in the next. It was handed over by the entire generation to the next generation.

 

if the Quran was edited in a period time then there will be more than one different copy ..but there are millions of holy Quran books and all of them are the same in every part in the world and in every house

 

dear Kimo,

I never said "changed", but revised! It has definitely been edited and re-edited throughout history! The book currently existing as the official edition, was first edited after the prophet’s death! And is not the supposedly ”revealed” book! Since the revision was always made by the caliphate, the old version was replaced by the new official one. No drastic changes each time, still revised. I understand that this science is disputable, specially by the people of the faith! And I do respect that, nevertheless this is part of my study and the school of Orientalism I belong to!

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Guest Konjkav

as far of research i did my research for about 2 years and i have grown up in musilm community so i know everything about it. not only i have heard about it but also i have read and tought about it.

 

first about saying the allah apeares as someone in charge of mohamads sexual life.....just read ahzab special verse 50-51-52 there is no need to explain about this,,,,,

 

dont just believe what u hear but read and meditate, it doens mean that u are questioning God, but u want to know the turth,

 

mistakesm oh yes, many hesotrical specially, i wil mention it in my next writing cuz i dont have koran right now, i will for sure,

sientific , yes,,,,there is a verse that says " aftab dar batlaghi ghoroob mikonad" i will give u the adress next time for sure.

 

talking about hatered.....man koran is full of that, there are plenty of verses talking about killing christians, dont believe me. read it and i will give verses next time.

 

women, there is a chapter dedicated to women but,....hey it doesnt mean it cares about women, READ the chapter "nesa" please read it for urself, women according to koran do not have equal right to men. PLEASE READ FOR URSELF.....it is there,

our problem is that we dont read..

and follow what we hear without examining it and in this case examining is considered doubtin and it is sin, why,,,,,>?

 

after all these cand koran be from God?

 

i thought it was and i was told it was and i was told to read it in arabic and not to questions it, but when i did question it i saw ,,,,,man this is just a big big lie

 

 

 

i am telling u all this cuz i know u r inteligent people

 

 

take care ...........................

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Remember, in life everything is subjective. You might read and understand something one way and I might understand that same thing in a different way.

 

Perceptions and already made opinions will guide us in one direction and won't allow us to see the entire picture.

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Guest Guest_I'am

u should ask this question to Mullah not us :ph34r:

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Well I'm the last person who's into religion and stuff...I gave it up, it's really nuthin for me...I'm free of everythin and happy with it :rolleyes:

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Well I'm the last person who's into religion and stuff...I gave it up, it's really nuthin for me...I'm free of everythin and happy with it :rolleyes:

Yea me too !!! :p

 

If god wants me to do somethin' he will have to ask me :D

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Well I'm the last person who's into religion and stuff...I gave it up, it's really nuthin for me...I'm free of everythin and happy with it  :rolleyes:

Yea me too !!! :p

 

If god wants me to do somethin' he will have to ask me :D

Me three :lol:

 

I'm not into relegion at all! However, I do believe that God watches over us ;)

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Guest Guest

I am not exactly a religious person but I do like to read about religion.

when you read the quran you must keep in mind where, when, and to whom it was first revealed to.

I do agree that in "Nesa" there are things written about how men are supposed to treat women, that are not exactly fair(for our time) but I'm not sure about it saying that women are "stupid or "unworthy". but do you really believe that if the quran had taught men to treat women as equal(which interestingly enough it does mention that) they would have even understood it?

 

 

Quran is only just a beginning towards supposedly a divine life, quran is not complete, not for our time anyways, and if you believe in god, you should consider that she/he endowed you with intelligence to think, learn, and act. you can learn from quran but you can't possibly base your entire life on it.

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Guest maheshabe14
Why Allah "supposedly the creator of heaven and earth" appears of someone in charge of mohammads sexual life? " ahzab 50

why is it that in islam says " dar din ejbari nist" then whoevr turns back from Isalm should be killed?

if this is so, so free will would have no meaning. and hell and judgment day wouldnt be nessasary cause we punish people here on earth.

if Koran is the book from heaven why is it that you see many contridictions and mistakes"even historical " and it all talks about killing and hatered.

if it cares about women why is it that in nesa soreh it all talks about that how stupid and unworth women are?

 

 

 

i am just conused ..............

first about saying the allah apeares as someone in charge of mohamads sexual life.....just read ahzab special verse 50-51-52 there is no need to explain about this,,,,,

 

i dunno what ur trying to get out of this one but i alwayz thought that in islam sex was a very important aspect..i guess u could say that if its done the right way and that is the pure way in marriage u will experience HEAVEn on earth..

 

secondly i recommend that when u read holy books like the Quran and the Torah and so on u look at the positive aspects and not the negative ones..these books are only here to guide us in the right dirction not stary us away from reality and each other..

 

thirdly islamn does not look at women as badly as u think..in many parts of the quran it looks at women as jewels..even the Prphet of Islam mohammad looked at his daughter Fatiemh as a saint and as he said "pareye jigaram"..

why not talk about the positive sides???

 

Also u cannot say that islam is a religion of violence..because its not..in many parts of teh Quran u see brotherly love..quotes like"trat every colour the same" and so on....

 

these are just things that ive learned and i thought id share it with u..im only 18 ..i am a muslim but before anything i am a human being and i look kindly on a ll religions because religions are a way to show us right and wrong and how we use it is up to us..

 

lots of love..leyla

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Guest Konjkav

my dear 18 year old freind,

 

that is good that u always look at the things in a positive way.......but have u ever asked urself that Qoran that claims it is a "divine book" why should have negative things? if it is divine than whats up with all this violence and discremination?

 

talking a bout women.....mmmm....sounds that u have not read the " nesa soooreh" ,,,,if you read that you will see that it says you can hit your women when she maked mistake,,,,,says hit her as u hit a camel......pls read that..

 

talking about "trat every colour the same" .......have u read that it says fight with christians and jews and if they dont become muslims kill them , and u can get their wives? READ it ....it is there............

 

women jweles..... :lol: if i say : borther i love you, but then i start doing all bad things to you, will my words cover my deeds? qoran says women are like jewels but it says they dont have same rights as man.......hit the women.......it is obvious,,,,,,many many other things....i dont want to write about them.

 

 

I do not condemn muslims,,,,,,i am just trying to tell,,,,,freinds read and thinkk before u follow something.,.......

 

it says you are free to have your religion......you may say ...see it is freedom that qoran gives to every human......have u nothiced it teaches to kill every muslim who wants to be a jew or christian or any other relgion? is that freedom to chose.....where is the free will? who are we to decide and force how peple live? see? it says u are free to follow but somewhere else u must die.........sad but true

 

anyways........i just cant get it why pepole dont Read.....and when they read why dont they read it in a language that they would understand the words and y dont they meditate or even question?

 

yours truley

konjkav

Iran

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Guest Guest

Dear Konjkav,

You have all the rights to want to clear your ideas about Islam.

Criticising Isalm doesn't mean promoting christianity.

If I was living in Iran, and was imposed to think, act and live as Islam says 24 hrs a day, I would put everything under question too. Its only normal and intelligent and corrageous of you to do that.

Our friends who live outside Iran are continuosly being criticised and picked on by the western society on Islam and all problems relative to integralism, terrorism and violence in these days and are rather sensitive on the arguement.

 

I don't really know if and why there are contradictions in Koran or Islam. What I can tell you is that it was a philosophy that was created 1400 years ago in those circumstances and time concept. So you should judge the good will of its promoter (the profit mohamad) considering this fact. I mean put yourself in his place and at that time and you'll realize how extraodinary his achievements were. That is something you should hand it to him!! Another thing I wanted to say is that don't let that the islamic fundamentalism and all the evil immage of islam that is being expanded all around the world, influent totally your evaluations. Islam does have many positive principles and giude lines.

 

The question that comes to my mind is: do we really have to believe in one and unique idea, relegion or philosophy to be good human beings? Is it not better study all ideologies and select from each of them the parts that we think is more appropriate and correct to define our values, preferably without declaring war on anybody?!

 

lots of luck konjkav

tanny

female 34 Italy

 

 

 

PS in the 2nd year of elementary school in Iran, in the science subject, I was taught that in order to be a good scientist you need to be konjkav!! (remember the story of the worm in the sand ??) Well that can be also valid in humanistic subjects: Socialogy, phylosophy, religion etc.

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Guest Sahar

Think realistically. How could the Koran, a book that was written so long ago, really be THAT really. There are already newer religions (e.g Baha'i faith) whose holy books seem a little more practical for people of this day and age. But of course, Islam is a great relgion to say the least. Just my opinion..

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Guest maheshabe14
my dear 18 year old freind,

 

that is good that u always look at the things in a positive way.......but have u ever asked urself that Qoran that claims it is a "divine book" why should have negative things? if it is divine than whats up with all this violence and discremination?

 

talking a bout women.....mmmm....sounds that u have not read the " nesa soooreh" ,,,,if you read that you will see that it says you can hit your women when she maked mistake,,,,,says hit her as u hit a camel......pls read that..

 

talking about "trat every colour the same" .......have u read that it says fight with christians and jews and if they dont become muslims kill them , and u can get their wives? READ it ....it is there............

 

women jweles..... :lol: if i say : borther i love you, but then i start doing all bad things to you, will my words cover my deeds? qoran says women are like jewels but it says they dont have same rights as man.......hit the women.......it is obvious,,,,,,many many other things....i dont want to write about them.

 

 

I do not condemn muslims,,,,,,i am just trying to tell,,,,,freinds read and thinkk before u follow something.,.......

 

it says you are free to have your religion......you may say ...see it is freedom that qoran gives to every human......have u nothiced it teaches to kill every muslim who wants to be a jew or christian or any other relgion? is that freedom to chose.....where is the free will? who are we to decide and force how peple live? see? it says u are free to follow but somewhere else u must die.........sad but true

 

anyways........i just cant get it why pepole dont Read.....and when they read why dont they read it in a language that they would understand the words and y dont they meditate or even question?

 

yours truley

konjkav

Iran

hey..thnx for calling me ur 18 year old friend..i appreciate it hon..

i dont agree with everything that the Quran says becuase i am living in a differnet tiem period tahn when it was given to the Prophet Muhammad..

sometimes i think that the reason i dont agree with such things is because im mis interpereting the content..maybe u are too..

if the Quran says beat ur wives..only idiotic people will misuse this verse and beat their wives.have u heard about the Prophet beating his wives??

no religion is perfect..the Torah and the Bible are divine aswell and they have alot of mistakes aswell..angain they might be mistakes in our eyes because no one can truly say what God meant by the words spoken in the Quran..

 

tha reason i think that the Quran may sayto kill people diverting from Islam is because agaian of the time period..people would do anything for realigion..it was anew religion and no oen would listen.. say this Mr.konjkav..has ur father ever s;lapped u??or yelled at u? would u call ur father a violent man or would u tell urself taht he loves u and he doesnt want u to make mistakes???

u see many chiristains being violnet aswell but u dont say CHRIStians are violent do u??u say that person is violent..but when a muslim does something..everyone assumes that the religion is violent..

 

im muslim ..i am going to marry a Bahai man but u think people are going to kill me just because i did that?? i have many friends who are Bahai and they have realtives who have married muslims and many of the muslims who have converted to Bahai faith.. i dont feeel taht my life is danger..because ignorance is not in my religion..everyone has a brain to think and interpret things using the brain taht God has given them..so saying go read this verse and see what religion u have accepted is far from what we neeed these days..

we neeed things to bring us closer not condemn otheers for tehir religion because of a couple of verses..look at ythe things that religions have the same and share not what makes tehm different or worse than the other..

 

as they say honey.....curiuosity is good....but too much curiousity killed the cat;)

lots of love..leyla

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Guest Konkav

1- me living in iran has nothing to do with this

2- i never talked about the ideas that religious learders have... i all talked about what qoran says

3- you say the qoran is not comlete .... can God send and incomplete thing for human kind?

4- do you compaer slaping of my father by killing inocent people

5- and this is not religious people coming up with killing musilim converts....Koran says that....

6- i am not promoting any religion i am just saying islam is not divine

7- did the prophet beat his wife.....yes....mohammad teaches that in koran

8- i am not interpreting the verses,,,,,i say what is written,,,no need for interpreting it....it is so obvious,.,,,,"koran says that too...Koran is so obvious and has no need for interpratation,

 

9-our problem is that we are always tought you are born with a religion......this is not true....if my family is musilm, christian ......doesnt mean that i have to follow the same religion...i dont heritate that......

10-

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Guest konjkav

Sorry , Had to write done fast, forgot to say bye

 

:p

 

bye

konjkav

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You say what is written?

Then you must truly be the most KNOWLEDGEABLE person around!

 

BECAUSE for every verse, there is an INTERPRETATION.

 

For every law, there is an INTERPRETATION.

 

:rolleyes:

 

It's why there are different sects of islam. It's why every Imam that preaches, preaches something different. It's a hard text to understand. And if you don't know arabic, to translate it to another language and then interpret it it can get a bit more difficult to interpret the correct way.

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Guest Guest_maheshabe14
1- me living in iran has nothing to do with this

2- i never talked about the ideas that religious learders have... i all talked about what qoran says

3- you say the qoran is not comlete .... can God send and incomplete thing for human kind?

4- do you compaer slaping of my father by killing inocent people

5- and this is not religious people coming up with killing musilim converts....Koran says that....

6- i am not promoting any religion i am just saying islam is not divine

7- did the prophet beat his wife.....yes....mohammad teaches that in koran

8- i am not interpreting the verses,,,,,i say what is written,,,no need for interpreting it....it is so obvious,.,,,,"koran says that too...Koran is so obvious and has no need for interpratation,

 

9-our problem is that we are always tought you are born with a religion......this is not true....if my family is musilm, christian ......doesnt mean that i have to follow the same religion...i dont heritate that......

10-

hey again..my accopunt is scrwed up so i had to sign in as guest..

well mr.konjkav u cant say that a certain religion is not divine because how can anne really say what divine truly is?? if u speak about it that way than no realigion is divine..

the way ur speaking is giving everyone the impression that u are bashing islam..

 

i agree with angel ..there is interpretations about everything so dont say that the koran is what it is.. its just liek how ur misinterpreting my words..how can u not misinterpret the Koran and other books?

 

 

take care..bye

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Guest Konjkav

well. interpratation........when the book says fight with anyone christian and jew (it is written in koran...i can show u the verse) there is no need interpratation......it is so obvious......if you read this book in farsi you will see these things....u leave isalm and find a religion you must die......there is no need to interpret......(even if u see this radical muslim are beheading people in iraq they are following true islam.)

of course there are some interpratation on some verses which cuases different dinaminations but the soirit is the same....kill anyone who leaves isalam and rejects islam.....i am not talking about some people called"muslim" teaching this i am talking about the "koran" teacing this.....there were some people called "christians" who even killed people , this is they own way of thinking Bible never talks about killing....get my point..

 

again as i said i dont have anything against muslim people, i am against the book.....

 

 

there is o need to interpret a verse which is so obvious in transfering its message......there is nothing symbolic in these verses that need to be interprated...some books thy need interpratation in the light of the whole book , like Book of revalation the last book of the Bible, but there are verses which speaks so clear.....

 

and i am not "the most knowledgable person around", i just Read and do my own research , i dont talk things i hear or taught, i research and understand myself.

 

 

 

talking about different sects of islam......woooo,, i have alot to talk about that, that is whole different thing which ofcourse worth to talk about,,,,,,one of the other signs that indicates that koran is not divine. it is nothing like christian or anyother religion dinamination, it is totally different........lets not get into it now, if u agree.

 

and i think Divine is a book that has no mistakes, has no discrimination and offers a certain, assured way to get to God, not all maybes , '

and something spiritual , not all worldly things, somthing that draw man close to God, (my favorite part to talk about)lol

 

I believe the only way to find out about truth is to be open and ask questions and look for an answer that truley satisfies u, not just an answer.......something that makes sense,,,,something tjhat u can rely on , not just something that others interpret with their intelegent.........

 

 

 

anyways, u guys are great

see u around.

 

 

(by they way,,,do i have to register here)?

konjkav

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Guest maheshabe14
well. interpratation........when the book says fight with anyone christian and jew (it is written in koran...i can show u the verse) there is no need interpratation......it is so obvious......if you read this book in farsi you will see these things....u leave isalm and find a religion you must die......there is no need to interpret......(even if u see this radical muslim are beheading people in iraq they are following true islam.)

of course there are some interpratation on some verses which cuases different dinaminations but the soirit is the same....kill anyone who leaves isalam and rejects islam.....i am not talking about some people called"muslim" teaching this i am talking about the "koran" teacing this.....there were some people called "christians" who even killed people , this is they own way of thinking Bible never talks about killing....get my point..

 

again as i said i dont have anything against muslim people, i am against the book.....

 

 

there is o need to interpret a verse which is so obvious in transfering its message......there is nothing symbolic in these verses that need to be interprated...some books thy need interpratation in the light of the whole book , like Book of revalation the last book of the Bible, but there are verses which speaks so clear.....

 

and i am not "the most knowledgable person around", i just Read and do my own research , i dont talk things i hear or taught, i research and understand myself.

 

 

 

talking about different sects of islam......woooo,, i have alot to talk about that, that is whole different thing which ofcourse worth to talk about,,,,,,one of the other signs that indicates that koran is not divine. it is nothing like christian or anyother religion dinamination, it is totally different........lets not get into it now, if u agree.

 

and i think Divine is a book that has no mistakes, has no discrimination and offers a certain, assured way to get to God, not all maybes , '

and something spiritual , not all worldly things, somthing that draw man close to God, (my favorite part to talk about)lol

 

I believe the only way to find out about truth is to be open and ask questions and look for an answer that truley satisfies u, not just an answer.......something that makes sense,,,,something tjhat u can rely on , not just something that others interpret with their intelegent.........

 

 

 

anyways, u guys are great

see u around.

 

 

(by they way,,,do i have to register here)?

konjkav

"and i think Divine is a book that has no mistakes, has no discrimination and offers a certain, assured way to get to God, not all maybes , '

and something spiritual , not all worldly things, somthing that draw man close to God,"

 

there u go honey..I THINK.....unless u know something for sure about a certain thing as important as a holy book and a religion u cannot condemn it for teaching certain things..

 

im not here to sat that ur wrong or right..(sage ki basham man?)....loool..im just a normal person whose giving my opinion on this topic..

ill say this aswell..i agree with many things that u said..i dont totally disagree with everything u say....i just dont like talking bad about other religions..i think religion is just as u said something spiritual to make u closer to God..(lets not talk about satanic cults and things that like that make u stray away from God) .....religion shows u right and wrong and helps u to be better people and also cherish and respect and learn from other people and religions who are different....

 

personally i believ that all realigions are divine in teir own way..anything that makes u a better and stronger person is something that we need in todays materialistic world...

 

sooooo any other topics u wanna discuss Mr.Konjkav??? :p :p

 

 

lots of love ....leyla

 

oh and u dont have to register..but that way people can send u private messages..just for ur knowledge:)

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Guest Konjkav

well, cant tell all religions are divine, cause naot all of them talk abuot love and not all of them draw u near to God.

 

if God wants to send somethig to human kind wold send something complete regardless of the time, either it is in old times or present time.

so a book full of contridictions and full of mistakes(historical and sientific) and full of hatered and agony and voilence cant be from a loving God,

 

Other reason that all riligion are not from God and all cant be good is becasue they do not approve each other, as matter of fact their doctorine is completely against each others.

for example ISalam and chistianity have totally different tyeachings , not even close.,....isalm rejects christianitties most important doctorine(which if u take that out of christianity then would be nothing left for Christianity)

 

hi leilla

:D

:D

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Guest maheshabe14
well, cant tell all religions are divine, cause naot all of them talk abuot love and not all of them draw u near to God.

 

if God wants to send somethig to human kind wold send something complete regardless of the time, either it is in old times or present time.

so a book full of contridictions and full of mistakes(historical and sientific) and full of hatered and agony and voilence cant be from a loving God,

 

Other reason that all riligion are not from God and all cant be good is becasue they do not approve each other, as matter of fact their doctorine is completely against each others.

for example ISalam and chistianity have totally different tyeachings , not even close.,....isalm rejects christianitties most important doctorine(which if u take that out of christianity then would be nothing left for Christianity)

 

hi leilla

:D

:D

hey to u too konjkav..loool..

 

islam and christianity dont contradict each other honey..i went to a catholic school, here for 4 years and it was amazing to see that so many of the doctrines are present in both religions..

yes muslims dont believe in the Trinity but other things are relatively the same....

Christainity stemed from Judaism and as u probably already know Jesus was a Jew all his life so to say that religions contradict each other is not true to that extent..

 

MOST religions talk about love and want to direct u in the right path in life..its just up to its followers to use it in a respectful and loving way...

 

u say that islam si not divine..again i say u might be misinterpreting...there are so many things that after millions of years scientists are finding out now which were already present in the Koran.. for instance the slitting into two parts of the moon by the Prophet......while scientists were working on a project they figured out that the moon was actually split in to two years and years ago..

the Koran talks about life in the most beautiful way possible..it says that one by one each cell in teh body kills itself so that the other parts of teh body can opperate in the right way and look as it does now..

 

in other books Islam time and time again speaks about kindness to ur children and to ur elders..it talks about not even killing an ant as in the nahjolbalagheh.. islam talks about helping the poor and in no religion does it say that u HAVE TO help the poor..Islam even gives a percentage that u have to give up to the poor..if im not mastaken i think it is 1?3 or something of ur possessions..(it slipt my mind at the moment)

 

theres things wroong in the bible aswell..for instance..Jesus was put on the cross to die for humanities sins.....if this is so..than what point is there for us to be good????isnt it that he has given up his life to forgive our sins?????

 

again im not that old or wise to say what something is supposed to be like..but so far this is what i have learned..

 

no one pushed me to be a Muslim....i studied it and chose it for myself..if i pray i pray for God..if i want to wear a scarf i do it for God and myself..if i want to help the poor i do it again for the sake of helping humanity and not showing off to other people....

 

 

all the best...waiting for ur disagreements.. :p

 

khodafezzzz :lol: leyla

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