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What non-activists can do to help Iran


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#1 espandyar

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Posted 14 February 2006 - 08:16 AM

FYI doostan;



Only if all my compatriots knew how much IRI's apologists and lobbyists such as NIAC, AIC and IAPAC, who I consider as our enemies, have been working against "Iran Freedom Support Act". Please write a one-liner or even one sentence (i.e. "I support Iran Freedom Support Act") to any number of Congressmen or Congresswomen you can.

We need to have a stronger opposition inside and outside Iran to defeat the ruling thugs. Thus we can use any support we can get. Believe me, writing to the representatives is very effective and this is the least we can do to help individuals like the young girl called "Masjed Soleymaani Hastam" or 600 students who just recently wrote a letter asking for our help, etc. I'm sure you all agree that reading and posting news is not all that there is to fighting the mullahs.

So, please don't let our beloved Iranian compatriots inside Iran down and let us show it with our deed. Please do what Ruzbeh is asking us below and pass this to anyone you know.

Siavash

--------------------------------------
The following is a post that i originally posted on my blog. I want
to convince those who are not politically active that they can still
make a difference. Maybe this will help those of you who have non-
politically active friends and family to become active in their own
way.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
There are many Iranians and non-Iranians alike who are not
associated with any formal political organizations, but who
nevertheless want to do something more concrete then simply checking
the news and debating politics with their freinds and family. If you
are one of those people, here is what you can do:

In 2004, Republican Representative Ileana Ros-Lehtinen proposed a
bill called the Iran Freedom Support Act. The purpose of the act is
two-fold. First, it tightens and hopefully corrects the flaws of the
Iran-Lybia Sanctions act. Second, it provides substantial funding to
organizations that are dedicated to a free and democratic Iran.
Furthermore, it only makes these funds available to those
organizations that refute terrorism (sorry MKO). This funding is
desperately needed in order to purchase the tools we need to spread
the message of democracy and freedom in Iran. The bill has already
been approved by a congressional committee, but we need your help to
have it approved by Congress.

The best thing about having a free and fair democracy is that
Congressional representatives in both houses will listen if you make
your voice heard. Join us in sending your support to your
congressional representatives. Get the contact information here.

Remember, the congress-men and -women that you contact do not have
to be from your area. The more people you contact the better! You
don't even have to be American. Politics is increasingly a global
phenomenon. If we can get this bill enacted into law the Islamic
Regime in Iran will become even weaker.

Help us help Iran.

Marg Bar Jomhorieh Eslami!

http://www.iranfreed...t.blogspot.com/

#2 Hashemi

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 12:22 AM

So you're all for democracy? Well so am I.

But the problem is that under a fully democratic scenario, people will vote to the most Islamic party anyway, just as what happened in Iraq, Afganistan and Palistine.

and we will be left with a bunch of retarded Islamists ruling. All we'll gain is probably a removal of the law on headscarves.

So I say shove the stupid rhetoric, and lets build the country.

#3 MeehanDoost

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 02:39 PM

So you're all for democracy? Well so am I.

But the problem is that under a fully democratic scenario, people will vote to the most Islamic party anyway, just as what happened in Iraq, Afganistan and Palistine.

and we will be left with a bunch of retarded Islamists ruling. All we'll gain is probably a removal of the law on headscarves.

So I say shove the stupid rhetoric, and lets build the country.


I don't agree that Iranian people would vote for an Islamic type of a country like the Palestinians and Iraqis. Unlike those two countries, Iranians have been living under Islamic rule for 27 years now, don't like it, and want to change it. The analgoy to the Palestinian situation is not really a good one because there Hamas was the only other alternative to the PLO and people didn't like the PLO, so there was really no other option. With regard to Iraq, the Shias had been oppressed for 30 years by Saddam, and this was a backlash. A backlash would occur in Iran, but in Iran Iranians would not want an Islamic Ruled gov't since they have exprienced it for 27 years and don't like it, and will get rid of it.

And I'd like to point something out, Hashem. In a post in a different discussion, you said that changing the IRI would be a mistake. Your statements are fully contradictory to the ones here that democrary would bring in "a bunch of retarded Islamist rulings" and that you don't support such rulings -- but aren't these kinds of rulings occuring now??? if you don't like such Islamic rulings and are worried that democrarcy would lead to such rulings, why do you hold the position that changing the IRI is a mistake? They make such rulings ALL the time and therefore the system should be changed so such rulings are not made, right?

Be Naameh Khodaavandeh Iran Zamin


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#4 Hashemi

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 06:37 PM

I consider anyone who believes in stupid theologies and religions as retarded.
But is that the real problem in Iran? Is our problem headscarves? No. It’s improper management and the squandering of national resources that is killing us.

I’m sorry to say this my friend, but when you get to the bottom of it, the major portion the squandering has nothing to do with the structure of the regime (although I wish from the bottom of my hart that I could say that that is case). The real problem comes from the nature of the resources we have most, oil and gas. We have to free our economy from being dependent on oil.

Until that day we can keep on switching the regime every 25 years and we’ll always end up with the same old problem, just as we are now, just as we were in 1979.

#5 Hashemi

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Posted 04 March 2006 - 07:38 PM

If these stupid opposition groups had spent their effort on telling the government to stop the squandering of our resources on the game Jahad-Sazandgi has started by pipining gas up to every village up every mountain, or had they put their effort on telling the government “Screw the poor” and cut off these Funking subsidies you’ve put on petroleum that is suffocating the economy, they would have proven them selves to be Meehandoost.

But oh no, they had to focus on things that are tantamount, and run off with stupid blind rhetoric; “Marg bar Khomeini”. These people are akin to Khomeini. Just as he didn’t stop and ask himself maybe incremental change will be better, and stuck to his blind rhetoric; “Marg bar shah”.

#6 MeehanDoost

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 02:41 AM

Well, the truth of the matter is that as long as there is theocratic rule in Iran, there can be no real liberty or freedom. This is because women cannot choose if they want to wear Hijab, people are not free to discuss certain matters because otherwise they will be called "infidels" and put to death, and many many other examples. So I beg to differ that the current regime is not the problem.

The only way that Iranians can be free and not be scared about what they say or wear or believe is to have a gov't that is not ruled by as a theocracy.

To to respond to Hashemi that asks whether stupid theology is our problem in Iran, the answer is YES 100%. When you have rules that women must be covered up all the time, when you cannot change your faith from Islam (or if you do you face death), when you are not free to say things that you do not agree with in Islam (or face death if you do), when homosexuals are killed because they have had homosexual sex, how can you say theology is not the problem??? All of these rules are dervied from theology.

There is no way to have these rules, which must be in place if Iran is to remain and Islamic Republic because these rules are embeded in Islamic law (mostly in the Quran itself), and have true liberty.

Be Naameh Khodaavandeh Iran Zamin


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#7 Hashemi

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 04:00 PM

What you are referring to is exactly what I mean by “tantamount”. Women being covered up ! Is that the problem we have?

From my experience in working for the department of Science (vezarat-oloom) and the department of petroleum, I’ve seen squandering of resources and embezzlement so huge that you wouldn’t believe.

These squanderings are happening not because of the structure of the regime, but because of what is known as “band-bazi”. The people doing these things don’t give a Shoot about Iran or Islam or Freedom of speech or Women or Shah or Khomaini or anything other than their own pockets,

and there will be people doing the same Shoot under any other regime. Just as there were during Shah’s time. Just as there are now.

and this “band-bazi” is happening because of the way in which the government gains revenues, through selling oil, not because of its structure.

I beg you to not be like Khomieni, open your eyes and see what the real problem is.

#8 Hashemi

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 04:28 PM

The thing preventing those who see these things from becoming "whistel-blowers" isn't because of "freedom of speech" or that they are frightened of the regiem, its because they are frightened of the "band" from getting at them.

in addition the fact that revenues come from selling oil makes those working in high possitions feel that; well this a "sofreh" put out, lets all eat from it. So its like Vegas, what happens there stays there.

But this has nothing to do with the Islamic-based nature of the regime.

#9 MeehanDoost

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 09:18 PM

And based on your statements, the regime should be changed so such crap doesn't keep happening. The regime is corrupt and is the cause of all of this.

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#10 Hashemi

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 09:44 PM

Yes the regime is corrupt, but its corruption does not stem from its structure,

We can change the regime over and over again, and will always end up with the same corruption problem, because the root of the problem wont be harmed by changing the regime.

#11 MeehanDoost

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 09:54 PM

Yes the regime is corrupt, but its corruption does not stem from its structure,

We can change the regime over and over again, and will always end up with the same corruption problem, because the root of the problem wont be harmed by changing the regime.


Off course the root of the corruption stems from the structure, and the structure BELONGS TO THE IRI. This is because there is no transperancy, any checks on the gov't, or the like. The IRI does whatever it wants and the people cannot question it. Khamenei has the final word on EVERYTHING and cannot be vetoed AT ALL. He can choose to veto laws passed by the Majlis for no reason at all, if he doesnt like them. The people do not have access to the information. Money is handled by the IRI and given to their friends. The IRI officials take money and put them in their own bank accounts. So for the structure to be changed, the IRI must be changed.

As long as you have the theocracy ruling Iran and people cannot figure out what happens to the revenue that the country gets and as long as the IRI officials can do whatever they want with the money and give no reports, things will remain the same. The ROOT that needs to be changed is the theocratic authoritarian style gov't. That MUST be changed for the corruption to lower. That means the IRI must change.

What are you in favor of??? Keeping the IRI? If yes, how do you propose to fix the problems? If the IRI or their structure is not the problem, what is the problem then? Can you please be a little more specific instead of making generalized statements?

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#12 Hashemi

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 11:23 PM

Off course the root of the corruption stems from the structure, and the structure BELONGS TO THE IRI.


Are we starting a word game now?

Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure", from the structure on which we have built our economy.


This is because there is no transperancy, any checks on the gov't, or the like. The IRI does whatever it wants and the people cannot question it.


As far as I know anyone can get up and object to things like major componants of the anual budget.

and you talk of transapency as if its a natural thing that all governments achieve and only the IRI hasn't. Transparency is an esential part of an efficient government. What has been and is preventing transparency from comming about is, as I said, due to the way in which the government gains revenues. Not the freakin way in which the regime is structured.

Khamenei has the final word on EVERYTHING and cannot be vetoed AT ALL. He can choose to veto laws passed by the Majlis for no reason at all, if he doesnt like them.


The only time Khamenei did something as stupid as that was when he vetoed the revision of the laws on publications. Which as I pointed out is tantamount to the real problems.

The people do not have access to the information. Money is handled by the IRI and given to their friends. The IRI officials take money and put them in their own bank accounts. So for the structure to be changed, the IRI must be changed.


You live in a very simple black and white world, just like Khomeini did.

He used to think that its as simple as that; "They're stealing the money and putting it in their bank accounts. We'll stop them and everything will be Ok, we'll be a rich nation and the poor will be fead".

As long as you have the theocracy ruling Iran and people cannot figure out what happens to the revenue that the country gets and as long as the IRI officials can do whatever they want with the money and give no reports, things will remain the same. The ROOT that needs to be changed is the theocratic authoritarian style gov't. That MUST be changed for the corruption to lower. That means the IRI must change.


You conclude that the corroption is due to the theocratic nature of the regime and people not knowing what happens to the revenues. The second is obvious, while I don't see the logical deduction that lead you to the first.

What are you in favor of??? Keeping the IRI? If yes, how do you propose to fix the problems? If the IRI or their structure is not the problem, what is the problem then? Can you please be a little more specific instead of making generalized statements?


Keep the IRI? As if its a pair of shoes, you try it for a while and if you don't like it, you throw it away.

Khomieni brought this kind of vision into the political ereana in Iran, and you guys got hooked on it.

Did you expect me to respond to the question on how to fix the economy in a paragraph?

What I can tell you is that every well structured "transparent" government in the world has come about only through incremental change.

#13 MeehanDoost

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Posted 05 March 2006 - 11:43 PM



Off course the root of the corruption stems from the structure, and the structure BELONGS TO THE IRI.


Are we starting a word game now?

Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure", from the structure on which we have built our economy.


This is because there is no transperancy, any checks on the gov't, or the like. The IRI does whatever it wants and the people cannot question it.


As far as I know anyone can get up and object to things like major componants of the anual budget.

and you talk of transapency as if its a natural thing that all governments achieve and only the IRI hasn't. Transparency is an esential part of an efficient government. What has been and is preventing transparency from comming about is, as I said, due to the way in which the government gains revenues. Not the freakin way in which the regime is structured.

Khamenei has the final word on EVERYTHING and cannot be vetoed AT ALL. He can choose to veto laws passed by the Majlis for no reason at all, if he doesnt like them.


The only time Khamenei did something as stupid as that was when he vetoed the revision of the laws on publications. Which as I pointed out is tantamount to the real problems.

The people do not have access to the information. Money is handled by the IRI and given to their friends. The IRI officials take money and put them in their own bank accounts. So for the structure to be changed, the IRI must be changed.


You live in a very simple black and white world, just like Khomeini did.

He used to think that its as simple as that; "They're stealing the money and putting it in their bank accounts. We'll stop them and everything will be Ok, we'll be a rich nation and the poor will be fead".

As long as you have the theocracy ruling Iran and people cannot figure out what happens to the revenue that the country gets and as long as the IRI officials can do whatever they want with the money and give no reports, things will remain the same. The ROOT that needs to be changed is the theocratic authoritarian style gov't. That MUST be changed for the corruption to lower. That means the IRI must change.


You conclude that the corroption is due to the theocratic nature of the regime and people not knowing what happens to the revenues. The second is obvious, while I don't see the logical deduction that lead you to the first.

What are you in favor of??? Keeping the IRI? If yes, how do you propose to fix the problems? If the IRI or their structure is not the problem, what is the problem then? Can you please be a little more specific instead of making generalized statements?


Keep the IRI? As if its a pair of shoes, you try it for a while and if you don't like it, you throw it away.

Khomieni brought this kind of vision into the political ereana in Iran, and you guys got hooked on it.

Did you expect me to respond to the question on how to fix the economy in a paragraph?

What I can tell you is that every well structured "transparent" government in the world has come about only through incremental change.


You did an extremely good job at NOT answering my question of what should be done in your views to fix the problems.

So lets see -- flaws in your statements:

1) You said in your earlier post that the "Yes the regime is corrupt, but its corruption does not stem from its structure" but here you say " Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure",. That's CONTRADICTION NUMBER ONE IN YOUR POSTS. SO WHICH IS IT? Instead of playing word games which you accuse me of, don't change your position to every response that I give.

2) You say that Khamenei has only vetoed on thing? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? He has vetoed many things and he holds the power to do it. The simple fact that one person has absolute veto power no matter what the people want is a STRUCTURAL PROBLEM that MUST BE CHANGED.

3) You say "What has been and is preventing transparency from comming about is, as I said, due to the way in which the government gains revenues." WRONG my friend. There is no transparency because the IRI does NOT release any information and does whatever it wants with regard to MANY things, not just gov't revenues. This is a STRUCTURAL problem.

To even take the argument from YOUR statements, if the problem is the control over gains of revenues and the IRI is in CHARGE of that operation, the root of the problem is the IRI. Therefore to fix the problem, the IRI's STRUCTURE of doing things must be changed.

4) You say "You live in a very simple black and white world, just like Khomeini did. He used to think that its as simple as that"

It's not simple, and I am not saying its simple. So please don't misrepresent my views and just do propoganda. Making excuses for the IRI and trying to blame everything on everyone else is wrong. I am saying that in order to have real change is to have real reform, which entails changing the IRI. That is in no way simple but is extremely complex.

5) You say "You conclude that the corroption is due to the theocratic nature of the regime and people not knowing what happens to the revenues. The second is obvious, while I don't see the logical deduction that lead you to the first."

IRI's theocratic regime which is authoritarian (as I pointed out) is one in which the governemnt can do what it wants regardless of the will of the people. Such a STRUCTURE leads to lack of transparency. That is the logical deduction.

6) Finally, you say

"Keep the IRI? As if its a pair of shoes, you try it for a while and if you don't like it, you throw it away.

Khomieni brought this kind of vision into the political ereana in Iran, and you guys got hooked on it.

Did you expect me to respond to the question on how to fix the economy in a paragraph?

What I can tell you is that every well structured "transparent" government in the world has come about only through incremental change."

Many points:

First, you do not respond to my question. HOW DO YOU THINK THE STRUCTURE SHOULD BE CHANGED?

I have not gotten hooked on anything that Khomeini has said. I am sure you know that I do not agree with much of the IRI or their views. Please, do not be a propaganda machine for the IRI.

I expect you to respond to to explain your statement in your earlier post where you said "Yes the regime is corrupt, but its corruption does not stem from its structure"

As I pointed out, you contradicted yourself in this post and stated "Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure"" So please tell me where does the corruption stem from?

You say that the lack of transparancy. But that was MY response to your statement. If you agree with that, then you must agree that the STRUCTURE must change because lack of transparancy is a STRUCTURAL problem. And since the IRI have put in place this STRUCTURE and are controlling it, the IRI --i.e., the ROOT OF THE STRUCTURE -- must be changed.

Be Naameh Khodaavandeh Iran Zamin


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#14 hashem

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Posted 12 March 2006 - 10:40 PM

1) You said in your earlier post that the "Yes the regime is corrupt, but its corruption does not stem from its structure" but here you say " Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure",. That's CONTRADICTION NUMBER ONE IN YOUR POSTS. SO WHICH IS IT?


Read my post again, specially what follows "Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure"... "

2) You say that Khamenei has only vetoed on thing? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? He has vetoed many things and he holds the power to do it. The simple fact that one person has absolute veto power no matter what the people want is a STRUCTURAL PROBLEM that MUST BE CHANGED.


If I'm "kidding you", then I'll be glad if you can refer me to documentation of other instances.
I agree that non-democratic componants in a governing body breed corruption (which was the problem with Shah's regime too by the way), and it does have to be changed. But it currently isn't the main problem in Iran. The main problem stems from elsewhere, and overthrowing the regime will only deepen the the main problem.

3) You say "What has been and is preventing transparency from comming about is, as I said, due to the way in which the government gains revenues." WRONG my friend. There is no transparency because the IRI does NOT release any information and does whatever it wants with regard to MANY things, not just gov't revenues. This is a STRUCTURAL problem.


The anual budget is fully documented and available. It does have flaws in it, but anyone can appose to any section of the budget. I guess what you are referring to is the money spent on secret overseas opperations, which is tantamount to the waist due to inefficiencies in the budget.

Transparency in how revenues are being spent isn't as easy as that. I was watching the House of Commons the other day, and they where yelling at each other about how money should be injected into the health sector so transparency in expenditure can be maintained.

To even take the argument from YOUR statements, if the problem is the control over gains of revenues and the IRI is in CHARGE of that operation, the root of the problem is the IRI. Therefore to fix the problem, the IRI's STRUCTURE of doing things must be changed.


There is no doubt that the way things are done have to be changed. But that isn't something that will be gained by overthrowing the regime.

It's not simple, and I am not saying its simple. So please don't misrepresent my views and just do propoganda. Making excuses for the IRI and trying to blame everything on everyone else is wrong. I am saying that in order to have real change is to have real reform, which entails changing the IRI. That is in no way simple but is extremely complex.


That's where you are wrong. Changing the regime is the simplest way out. Having tollerance and working side-by-side with people we disagree with so Iran can prosper is the hard but right way. The hard way that most of us have decided not to take, yet we call our selves meehandoost.

IRI's theocratic regime which is authoritarian (as I pointed out) is one in which the governemnt can do what it wants regardless of the will of the people. Such a STRUCTURE leads to lack of transparency. That is the logical deduction.


What I don't get is the deduction:

"theocratic regim" => "lack of transparency"

can't we have:

"non-theocratic regim" => "lack of transparency"

I mean is it an 'IF' or an 'IFF'.

First, you do not respond to my question. HOW DO YOU THINK THE STRUCTURE SHOULD BE CHANGED?


I belive that the governing body has to learn how to prevent cozy pockets that breed corruption from forming in its structure, and that is extremly hard to achive in a country that has an economy based on selling oil.

I guess this contradicts with your opinion that the Mullas had a master plan to enslave the Iranian nation and "put the money in their bank accounts".

I have not gotten hooked on anything that Khomeini has said. I am sure you know that I do not agree with much of the IRI or their views. Please, do not be a propaganda machine for the IRI.


Propaganda!

What do you think this is, mass meadia?
I hate to say this to you but other than me and you, the only person who might take a look at our posts is Pourya, and he'll just skim through to make sure we're not cussing at each other.

As I pointed out, you contradicted yourself in this post and stated "Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure"" So please tell me where does the corruption stem from?


As I said, the corruption stems from the "structure" on which our economy is built.
Please READ my post before responding in such a crass manner.

#15 Iranian 4 Eva

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Posted 12 March 2006 - 11:20 PM

All I know is that the American invasion of Iraq destroyed the chance for reform or even a large scale democratic movement in Iran. No fool in Iran wants his or her country weakened with an enemy pointing his guns right from our backyard.

No one wants democracy in Iran, not the mollahs, not our neighbours, not the west. Democracy is one of their main target of destruction.

Defend your nation today, persue democracy tomorrow!

#16 Hashemi

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 12:10 AM

Democracy isn't the outright solution to preventing corruption.

Look at Iraq. They recently passed a new law which extended the use of the death penalty to include "those who commit... terror acts" and for "those who provoke, plan, finance and all those who enable terrorists to commit these crimes".

http://news.bbc.co.u...ast/4790990.stm

How do you interperet the "provoking" of terrorism?! This is the very foundation for corruption in the governing body. Now anyone who questions the government can be considered to be "provoking" terrorism in a way.

and this law was passed by a democratic government.

#17 Iranian 4 Eva

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 12:35 AM

Iraq is no democracy. Lets hope the Iraq example will wake up those Iranians still asleep.

#18 MeehanDoost

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 02:01 AM



1) You said in your earlier post that the "Yes the regime is corrupt, but its corruption does not stem from its structure" but here you say " Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure",. That's CONTRADICTION NUMBER ONE IN YOUR POSTS. SO WHICH IS IT?


Read my post again, specially what follows "Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure"... "

2) You say that Khamenei has only vetoed on thing? ARE YOU KIDDING ME? He has vetoed many things and he holds the power to do it. The simple fact that one person has absolute veto power no matter what the people want is a STRUCTURAL PROBLEM that MUST BE CHANGED.


If I'm "kidding you", then I'll be glad if you can refer me to documentation of other instances.
I agree that non-democratic componants in a governing body breed corruption (which was the problem with Shah's regime too by the way), and it does have to be changed. But it currently isn't the main problem in Iran. The main problem stems from elsewhere, and overthrowing the regime will only deepen the the main problem.

3) You say "What has been and is preventing transparency from comming about is, as I said, due to the way in which the government gains revenues." WRONG my friend. There is no transparency because the IRI does NOT release any information and does whatever it wants with regard to MANY things, not just gov't revenues. This is a STRUCTURAL problem.


The anual budget is fully documented and available. It does have flaws in it, but anyone can appose to any section of the budget. I guess what you are referring to is the money spent on secret overseas opperations, which is tantamount to the waist due to inefficiencies in the budget.

Transparency in how revenues are being spent isn't as easy as that. I was watching the House of Commons the other day, and they where yelling at each other about how money should be injected into the health sector so transparency in expenditure can be maintained.

To even take the argument from YOUR statements, if the problem is the control over gains of revenues and the IRI is in CHARGE of that operation, the root of the problem is the IRI. Therefore to fix the problem, the IRI's STRUCTURE of doing things must be changed.


There is no doubt that the way things are done have to be changed. But that isn't something that will be gained by overthrowing the regime.

It's not simple, and I am not saying its simple. So please don't misrepresent my views and just do propoganda. Making excuses for the IRI and trying to blame everything on everyone else is wrong. I am saying that in order to have real change is to have real reform, which entails changing the IRI. That is in no way simple but is extremely complex.


That's where you are wrong. Changing the regime is the simplest way out. Having tollerance and working side-by-side with people we disagree with so Iran can prosper is the hard but right way. The hard way that most of us have decided not to take, yet we call our selves meehandoost.

IRI's theocratic regime which is authoritarian (as I pointed out) is one in which the governemnt can do what it wants regardless of the will of the people. Such a STRUCTURE leads to lack of transparency. That is the logical deduction.


What I don't get is the deduction:

"theocratic regim" => "lack of transparency"

can't we have:

"non-theocratic regim" => "lack of transparency"

I mean is it an 'IF' or an 'IFF'.

First, you do not respond to my question. HOW DO YOU THINK THE STRUCTURE SHOULD BE CHANGED?


I belive that the governing body has to learn how to prevent cozy pockets that breed corruption from forming in its structure, and that is extremly hard to achive in a country that has an economy based on selling oil.

I guess this contradicts with your opinion that the Mullas had a master plan to enslave the Iranian nation and "put the money in their bank accounts".

I have not gotten hooked on anything that Khomeini has said. I am sure you know that I do not agree with much of the IRI or their views. Please, do not be a propaganda machine for the IRI.


Propaganda!

What do you think this is, mass meadia?
I hate to say this to you but other than me and you, the only person who might take a look at our posts is Pourya, and he'll just skim through to make sure we're not cussing at each other.

As I pointed out, you contradicted yourself in this post and stated "Yes the root of the problem does stem from the "structure"" So please tell me where does the corruption stem from?


As I said, the corruption stems from the "structure" on which our economy is built.
Please READ my post before responding in such a crass manner.


Well, I am gald that you admitted that the problem is the structure, following your initial response that it wasn't. Point for me! :haha:

You say that you agree that that non-democratic componants in a governing body breed corruption and it does have to be changed. By that logic the IRI must change because the structure of the IRI is a non-democtraic theocracy.

Transparancy deals with many issues, not just the budget!

Again you agree that things need to be changed by saying "There is no doubt that the way things are done have to be changed." For things to change, the IRI must go away because they are the root of the problem.

This is too funny!!!! You say "Changing the regime is the simplest way out. Having tollerance and working side-by-side with people we disagree with so Iran can prosper is the hard but right way. The hard way that most of us have decided not to take, yet we call our selves meehandoost."

TOLLERANCE? LOOOOOL. THEY KILL WHOEVER DISAGREES WITH THEM. HOW CAN YOU WORK WITH PEOPLE LIKE THAT? THEY THROW PEOPLE WHO DISAGREE IN JAILS. THEY SHUT DOWN NEWSPAPERS! HOW MUCH PROPAGANDA WILL YOU DO FOR THE IRI????

The IRI are the ones that don't have tollerance. Get your facts straight.

And one more time: AUTHORITARIAN REGIME IN IRAN = NO TRANSPARANCY.

I think whoever has read your posts knows by now that you are a strong supporter of the IRI and you may even work for them. I think we have said enough and whoever reads these posts, I am sure is smart enough to make an informed judgment about the issue.

Be Naameh Khodaavandeh Iran Zamin


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#19 Hashemi

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 02:56 AM

I still disagree, but this discussion is getting no where.

I guess you've dicided that I'm working for the IRI or something (which explains why you are so quick at responding without deliberation). So it will get no where either.

#20 MeehanDoost

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Posted 13 March 2006 - 12:11 PM

I still disagree, but this discussion is getting no where.

I guess you've dicided that I'm working for the IRI or something (which explains why you are so quick at responding without deliberation). So it will get no where either.


Well, everytime I say that IRI needs to change, you are very quick to say to it shouldn't be changed. That is certainly not something that someone who does not support the IRI would say. And frankly, most people that support the IRI either work for it or somehow get benefits from it. This is at most 20% of the Iranian population.

If you are not a supporter of the IRI, then condemn their acts that are so inhumane and against Iranian heritage. Condemn the fact that they kill those who disagree with them. Condemn the fact the shut down newspapers. Condemn the fact they hit women. Condemn the fact that women are not given much value. Condemn the fact that they kill people because of alleged homosexula sex. Condemn the fact that they don't celebrate any Persian holidays (even with norooz they are forced it appears). Condemn the fact that they wanted to ban Iranians naming their children as Kourosh or Daruish. Condemn the fact that they wanted to name the Persian Gulf the Islamic Gulf. Condemn all these acts for which the IRI stands for.

The list can be ten pages, but you get the picture.

Be Naameh Khodaavandeh Iran Zamin


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